i fail to see the problem in asking if there is a performance oriented place where people who like modifying their cars performance slightly more than it's appearance could gather their cars and shoot the sh#t. yeah. personally, i would like to see 12 sec or better cars. CLEARLY. this does alienate some people. but what is wrong with that. anyone who puts time into a car can appreciate a fast car. so why cant people let me meet people with fast cars. rather than the 17 sec car shos without hubcaps up front and nittos on big rims in the back and tons of bass and neon? i just dont find that as interesting as LT1's and LS1's and i dont see the problem in assuming most 12 sec or better cars are V8's. there is always an exception. and i can appreciate those also. THE POINT IN THIS WHOLE THREAD was a meeting of gearheads. where the cops wouldnt come because some ricer is doing burnouts and blasting his stereo. does that make sense to anyone????