E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
03-15-2009 | 10:52 AM
#41
Still spinnin'
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From: away from you
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
Well, a proper air/fuel tune for E85 would be about 8.5:1, so unless you were able to go that rich and still maintain the electronic corrections, it would be absolutely terrible. I know if I start richening my mixture with the car idling, it will shut off before I get as rich as 8.5:1. I've never worked with a car with its electronic corrections intact, so I'm not really familiar with how much self-correcting-adjustment range they allow, other than I know that it varies between car makers.
If you full out tuned it for e85, and made it all motor (so you went to very high compression to utilize the 105 octane), you'd probably have to get out and retard the timing some if the knock sensors were absent...hell even if they were present it's a long way down from 105 to 93, and even with 8.5:1 a/f, they probably can't compensate for that on their own.
If you're on a boosted car, well just don't go high-boost, but I bet you could get away without having to retard the timing.
If you full out tuned it for e85, and made it all motor (so you went to very high compression to utilize the 105 octane), you'd probably have to get out and retard the timing some if the knock sensors were absent...hell even if they were present it's a long way down from 105 to 93, and even with 8.5:1 a/f, they probably can't compensate for that on their own.
If you're on a boosted car, well just don't go high-boost, but I bet you could get away without having to retard the timing.
03-15-2009 | 11:02 AM
#42
ATGATT
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From: Wangan
03-15-2009 | 11:07 AM
#43
ATGATT
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From: Wangan
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
The real benefit of e85 isn't in the fuel itself, but in that the fuel lets you run higher compression. 93 octane is high enough to allow you to advance the timing to the ideal range and run 11:1. Now, if you wanted to run 15:1 or 16:1 or so you would find 93 failing you, and that's where 105 octane comes in handy.
03-15-2009 | 03:34 PM
#44
Racetracks
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From: How long is a piece of string?
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
It's bad for aluminum too. Actually, since 1985 just about every car has been made with e10 in mind, but even then e10 does reduce the life of the rubber parts (this is all rubber parts that come in contact with fuel at any point, not just those carrying fuel from the gas tank to the engine bay), just to within an acceptable range. E85 does MUCH more. Racecars that run on alcohol use different materials for parts that contact the fuel than those that run on gasoline for good reason.
By the way, most of the alcohol corrosion problems with race engines are from methanol, not ethanol. Methanol makes very corrosive compounds, and ethanol isn't anywhere close for corrosion. Ethanol is still worse for corrosion than straight gasoline, but most of that has to do with water attached to the ethanol (ethanol is hydroscopic).
03-15-2009 | 06:47 PM
#45
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From: Va Beach
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
The only people that can help you with the benifits of E85 for your paticular car , is someone that has tuned cars to run on E85..This is a performance car forum.None of us give two sh#ts about the environment or going green as far as horsepower is concerned..Turbo cars have the greatest benifit, because E85 acts alot like c16, cost alot less, and is better at preventing detonation..Imagine having race fuel in your car all the time and always being in kill mode...Would you run C16 in your car always if it was the same price as super unleaded ? That is what E85 brings...
03-15-2009 | 09:15 PM
#47
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From: Fredericksburg
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
Corrosion is there but as long as you aren't using shitty cracked up rubber hoses you're fine. The problem is more for when the fuel sits in the lines. If you have a return type system you shouldn't have issues.
E10 doesn't do jack shit to your car as far as damage. It's better than regular 93 without Ethanol, for performance. I bet you're afraid of public toilets too.
03-15-2009 | 09:45 PM
#48
Racetracks
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From: How long is a piece of string?
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
E10 is actually blended to be correct rated octane. So if you're buying 93 octane with 10% ethanol, it's still 93 octane. It's not really better for performance, no.
03-15-2009 | 09:52 PM
#49
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From: Fredericksburg
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
Octane isn't everything. It's the properties of the ethanol itself that make it a more optimal fuel vs gasoline.
03-15-2009 | 09:57 PM
#50
Racetracks
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From: How long is a piece of string?
Re: E85 is in Va Beach for the PUBLIC !!!
The latent heat of vaporization difference from removing 105 of the gas and substituting 10% ethanol probably isn't a heck of a lot. And there still is the downside of the lower calorific content of the 10% ethanol, but that's still a small difference. Those two things probably balance themselves out. The oxygenation benefits don't really do a lot for performance either. I think it's pretty much a break-even for E10.