16g-95gsx

Please explain this to me, as what you say to me makes no sense. I have a 3bar GM MAP sensor, it logs true boost. Airflow in lb/min, you're correct is a nice value to have, however it doesnt tell u shit about the particular turbo you are running. Different turbos flow different air values at different boost, so why should I care about the airflow amount, boost is generally a better figure to look at for a quick glance. As far as caring about boost when not logging, I have DSMlink setup to give me a CEL if I go anything over 1* of knock retard, if anything boost wise were to go wrong Id be instantly told so even without any gauge, no need to look at any log, until I was to begin diagnosing the problem. Boost est is a decent figure for those who arent logging true boost figures, and would like to know where they were on particular runs. Ever made a run, and then the next run adjusted the boost level? How would you know if you had adjusted the boost level or not looking at the logs weeks from then without some sort of logged boost?

3bar sensor, and boost est are two great features, airflow in lb/min tells you nothing other than bragging rights and ability to double check your fuel system's limits as far as I'm concerned.

KPWSavestheDay

Are you kidding Chris? Airflow in lbs per minute has a direct relationship to the power you are making....pounds per square inch means absolutely nothing unless you are extremely familiar with the compressor map for the turbo you are running. What would you rather me tell you, something meaningless like your signiture (23 psi on pump gas) or something that gives you an actual idea of what is being made, ie airflow logs of 44 lbs/min.

Because the airflow logged will be higher. Also I always save my logs with the turbo they were on, the gas used, the psi I was running, and the date and number of run that day.

Boost doesn't mean anything. It is pressure as measured in the intake manifold but it doesn't tell you anything about the actual flow of air. Is 15psi on a t25 equal to 15psi on a t88? Of course not. That is why looking at lbs per minute or some measure of flow is much more important than the pressure the intake manifold is subjected to.

-T

16g-95gsx

True, lb/min directly relates to power you are making, however I was meaning for instantaneous diagnosis of what is going on within your motor, aka when something is wrong. 15psi on a T25, obviously is different from a T88, and I'd desperately hope that you'd know the difference in what airflow you should be running on both turbos, and in my opinion with DSMlink lb/min is nothing more than bragging rights after you have already tuned your system completely. Yes it is a great number for judging your overall state of tune, but from what I inferred from your post, you were stating that it was a better tool for judging your instantaneous state rather than psi, which I dont feel is correct if you know what your setup should be at. Basically you said having a logged boost source is irrelevant is what I recieved from your reply, which to me is absolutely wrong.

True, I suppose once airflow is all calibrated that is correct, I still was thinking in terms of my past experience calibrating the GM MAFT as well as tuning the car thereafter. The notes portion of DSMlink I dont use very often, but it is pretty much irrelevant to me at this point with the boost sources.

To me I think this statement is also half correct and half incorrect. Depending on what state of tune you are in both aspects are beneficial. During tuning I agree, for very established setups such as T25's, 14b's, 16gs, etc, I like to aim for a lb/min that I know the turbos generally are rated for, during the initial tune, and once the setup is fully tuned the manifold pressure definately would come into play as far as diagnosing problems. [/QUOTE]

Want me to change the sig to 40+lb/min on pump? I put it in there because 99% of the damn people on this forum dont recognize airflow figures. I run a FP Green, 1g head, DSMlink, fmic, full fuel setup, 3" catback, 38mm Tial, etc etc. Believe me I'm not worried about my sig on Dragva.com in the least

elementalwindx

LOL I love you guys. You make me wanna sell my 3 guages and 3 pod pillar and get a stocker and spend the $$ on a 3bar too lol. I love the sleeper look but I kinda also love the boost guage to glance at. It's a taste thing I suppose when it comes down to it. But here I am tryin to make people think its a gs lol. if I took those guages down, changed my rims, and painted my car red, 99.9% of the people would assume my car was a GS if it wasnt for my 2 ended tail pipe.

P.S. I'm still waiting for the darn delivery It didnt come today. I mailed it out monday, it got there tue at 8:30am, and he mailed it today (Wed), and it should get here tomorrow. but on the tracking # it doesnt say they picked up the package and I got the # at 8am this morning. blah

KPWSavestheDay

We could argue about this all day, but we won't. You do it your way, I'll do it mine.

I wasn't dissing your sig or saying anything about it other than the fact that knowing what psi you are running tells me nothing unless I know the turbo that is pushing that air, whether you have cams, a smim or anything else that would greatly affect the amount of airflow. Whereas....lbs/min will always be a clear indication of the power you are making and requires no other knowledge of the setup.

I always adjust boost until I am flowing a desired amount of air (which will translate into a certain amount of power onced tuned) and that is what I assume most people would be interested in doing.

-T

16g-95gsx

Yes telling you what psi I run without knowing my setup doesnt tell you much at all you are correct, however my point was that PSI still does play an important tuning role, that was the point in my long winded responses. I think there just was miscommunication between us.

srt4hokie

the DSM computer must be realy tuner friendly. I know the mopar computers are a hard nut to crack and if you try and talk about it publicly DCX comes knocking at your door, must be nice...

16g-95gsx

Well DSMlink for 2g's requires an eprom. Non-eprom ECU's cant be changed. But yes apparently it isnt too hard because DSMlink isnt the only eprom tuning out there, they also make preprogrammed chips from keydiver. Definately some kool things you can do with a single chip if you know what is going on. They just released the 1g version, and theres even more interesting things they've done with that, which ultimately will reach the 2g world as well it just will take some slight time.

elementalwindx

like what? and what is key driver?

I wish we had that security code like um whatsitcalled for the 1g where u press certain pedals so many times in a combination b4 u can start the car, making it almost impossible to steal lol

KPWSavestheDay

Key Diver is a modified chip that alters rev limits, compensates for larger injectors, gives you a stutterbox and no lift to shift, etc...similar to dsmlink except that you cannot change the settings once it has been burned and installed. Basically obsolete now that Tom and Dave have finished with the 1g version of dsmlink, but because of it's cost many people will probably still continue to buy them.

-T