sohc_mshue

right...because that was completely my fault

http://www.honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=1862276

69vette

Pretty sure I just said nothing against you. Alot was not said to me and thats mainly why i was unhappy with the situation. A simple phone call to explain a situation or ask what I wanted to do was never made. I was simply given back the broken car with parts pulled of it and then had to rely on one side of the story for all my facts. However, before the fact, I told YOU to adjust the boost and then you relied on someone else to do that and it was boost spiked on the street. It was then put on a dyno for whatever reason after it was already broken. Its done and over now. The motor has been rebuilt bigger and better. It will be taken to someone I have trust in or i'll just tune it myself like everything else so the above does not happen again.

sohc_mshue

You made plenty of argument against me on honda-tech that made no sense whatsoever, and you never payed me for spending A LOT of time on the car. Not to mention the basemaps i spent time to burn you probably 6 months before you even came to be tuned. I was suppost to go over to your house that day to talk to you after me and your brother got back, but when we were getting ready to leave your brother said not to worry about it and that he would talk to you because i guess he was in a hurry. Your brother has a dsm with over 400whp that he tuned himself and he also sais he has tuned plenty of you and his other setups so I would assume he knew how to work a simple mbc which he did. There is no set amount it has to be turned in order to reach the desired boost. Its a guess and check situation. If it boost spikes you just have to be careful to let off right away. I truly hope you take the car to someone else to be tuned because I doubt it will be properly tuned for high boost and race gas while your trying to dial the ignition curve in on the street with no torque output readings like you said you do with the rest of your cars.

C89ZX7R

+99999
HIS website http://shuetuning.com/

69vette

I'm not even going respond to you because its pointless but just so you know for future reference... one turn = 3lbs on a turbonetics boost controller. I told you that the day before you tuned it but i guess you forgot. Its not guess and check. Also, your own friends on honda tech told me to tell you to "stop being a pussy and tune the car on the street". Theres no reason 400-450 hp can't be tuned on the street safely. The guy tuning it has tuned numerous sohc's including a few that made 400-1450 hp and one that made 481 hp. I'm sure it will be right since he actually has experience with high hp sohc's

sohc_mshue

One turn does not always equal a set amount of boost on any boost controller. I've had experience with plenty of mbc's, many of them the same exact kind on different setups and it never has to be turned the same amount to reach the desired boost level. Apparantely my friends you talked to on honda-tech are not tuners or they would know that you cannot properly tune an ignition curve on the street. I'd really like to have some other tuners chime in here and discuss this with you because you obviously dont understand how to properly tune an ignition curve. The way you described to me that you do it is that "I turn the timing up until the knock sensor reads knock". For that to happen the car has to actually KNOCK which incase you didn't know...isn't exactly healthy. Also i'm guessing you have never been in a honda with over 400whp....they spin A LOT. This means you must do 4th gear pulls to tune them. I dont know about you, but I dont feel too comfortable riding in the car with somebody that i have no idea how well they can handle that kind of power, or how safe they can handle a car at those speeds. I mean honestly other honda tuners responded in that thread on honda-tech and told you the same things i'm telling you about trying to tune that power on the street. It isn't smart.

Also...I'd like to know who you are finding that can tune a sohc honda to 1450 hp because i'd like to personally shake their hand. That would be pretty much defying the laws of physics with a d series engine. Not to mention you'd have a hard time finding many dohc honda 4cylinders even brushing that kind of power.

ILLEGAL

well depending on your car, not the arguments on here, you can def go to www.inlinpro.com and they will def hook you up. I would also recomend Brian Fisher, if you can, or Norris, again, if you can. (might depend on if you know them to be able to get them to work on it for you.)

HighPSI TSi Guy

I tune cars on the street all the time. It's definitely not impossible at all. Spark plugs and a knock sensor will go a long ways. It really depends on the setup though. A lot of hondas don't have knock sensors so you'd basicly be going by feel and spark plug reading, which can still get it pretty close to right. It's easier on the dyno but plenty possible on the street. A 0-5v sensor helps a lot because you can see the engine noise and tell when you're close to the threshold. Going straight off torque readings on the dyno is only so accurate, every car is different. Different turbos, cam setups, motors, etc will all have different torque curves so going off a torque reading is never going to be more than a ballpark. Unless the motor is already on it's last leg or something, tuning at the knock threshold isn't really a big deal as long as you're careful. Usually you'll see some noise before the point where you're doing damage unless you're on C16 or alky or something similar. You're not tuning RX7s here. Piston engines will take a heavy beating. Though I can't say for sure, I don't mess with hondas often, maybe they are just as bad?

As for the boost controller, every car is different. I've seen some where 1 turn = 5 lbs and I've seen some that were 5 turns = 1 lb. sometimes it also changes depending on how much boost you're already running. I never turn one more than 1 turn at a time though. never know.

shue is correct about the spinning though. you can't accurately tune a car if it's spinning bad.

sohc_mshue

You can tell a lot from whats going on with the torque curve on a dyno. Often you dont even need to crank the timing up as high as the det threshold to reach mbt. You really cant tell if you are at this point unless being on the dyno. Going any further past that point is only stressing the engine more than it needs to be by reaching peak cylinder pressures at a non optimal angle and bringing you that much closer to detonation. On a setup tuned at the det threshold a bad tank of gas or something of that nature could be dissasterous.

I used to tune higher power cars on the street all the time too and I still do for lower power setups, but its just so much easier to be in a controled environment like the dyno with torque readouts. With a high power fwd car its just hard to do but so much on the street. I do use a homemade det can to listen for knock as well.

Honda engines are definately more finiky than some engines like dsm's for instance. Those engines can take quite a beating before letting go as i'm sure you know. Also with d series espescially having such a small bore timing needs to be on point as combustion can become uncontrollable quite easily. They cant make as much power on pump gas as a higher bore b series either.

Personally thats just how i feel about street tuning. If he wants to take it to someone that feels comfortable with doing it on the street then thats fine. Its just not the way i like to personally do things.

GuNnErgOd

Links plz.

for Matt Shue, great tuner and great guy.