Originally Posted by grifter757

Jesus, its the whole Ford vs Chevy thing again. I have to agree that this Motor is pretty madass but I think for now ford has given its all in the new 5.0. The after market will take time to catch up with the new motor and at first it will cost $$$$ to mod it like every new motor design when it first comes out. Oh and to those haters that say the camaro is a pig they already have them with turbo kits putting down 650 at the wheels and then there is this.

Originally Posted by Flite

Doesn't matter if the car makes 2000hp. Weight is weight. It's still a pig

Originally Posted by Cobra4B

So like every Ford 4V motor it's going to take major money or a FI swap? Please elaborate how I have no clue what I'm talking about. "Everyone" slapped a Vortech on the 4.6 DOHC mod motor in the '96-'98 Cobras because the only aftermarket for them was SHM and it was cost prohibitive and even after doing a stoker 5.0 and worked heads and cams the motors made like 380 rwhp max.

This new motor will be much of the same.... very few people do NA modding to this type of motor becaues the heads are costly and there are 4 cams and double the valvetrain components vs. a LSX. Sure it's a nice motor and has provisions for major boost. But I still stand by my original comment that it's nearly maxed out in NA form and that NA modding will still be cost prohibitive.

Now if you put real LTs on it and ditched the cats then maybe playing w/ the VVT can imitate swapping cams in to some extent and you can get some power... that'd be cool.... but I'd like to see the factory exhaust manifold first. Most new cars are coming with very efficient parts from the factory. The C6Z and ZR1 don't gain much at all from LT headers... most say it's the high-flow cats and the non-factory tuning that gets the actual gains as the oem manifold is a nice piece.

My $0.02.

Originally Posted by grifter757

its what a 300 pound diffrence? apparantly there is also alot of dead weight you can throw out your 2010 camaro (like mullets, case o beer, jean jacket, 8 tracks, and your fat GF) none of these are needed in todays time...

Originally Posted by ShawnD

Dyno Queen.

Originally Posted by Flite

The flip side of that argument is that you don't have to do that shit... because the car already has them, and already performs.

I got into this discussion with an F150 guy about my truck the yesterday. He thought it sucked for me that my truck already came with tubular headers and good flowing heads. "All I have to do is some head work and a set of long tubes and I can slap on 50hp". Great good for you.... I don't have to do any of that stuff... because it's already done. Would it have made my truck better if it cam with less power, but I could easily pay a couple thousand bucks and "unlock it"? Hell no... it's already unlocked... and warranteed.

With the new 5.0 Mustang, Ford has already done that stuff for you. Thumbs up to Ford

Originally Posted by brew engineer

So your frame of reference is based on the 12-14 year old 4.6L? Hum, that is interesting. It is funny to hear people say that most Ford engines are at their N/A limit stock when I can add an intake/tune and get 25hp gains. Add a decent set of headers and an open x pipe and you are creeping into the 35-40 hp gain range. Their are plenty of N/A guys on the S197 forums making close to 400whp without stroking out to 5.0L. It is just cheaper and easier to bolt on an SC kit. Ford builds the Mustang with the intention of selling aftermarket performance parts. That is why they have FRPP.

Originally Posted by Cobra4B

I think you misunderstood the argument.... the 5.0 is probably a wonderful motor for boost (if you don't crack the cast pistons). I mean guys run 8-10lbs on LSXs w/ stock pistons all the time w/o much issue so long as the tune is good etc.

My point is that w/ an LSX motor I can easily add 50 rwhp w/ an intake, headers, and a tune. A 2008 LS3 Corvette will make ~ 380 rwhp stock, and 430+ w/ LT headers and a tune.

This motor won't do that.... you're pretty much stuck around 390-400 rwhp (a great number OEM) unless you want to spend major money for NA upgrades (4v heads aren't cheap and you have to buy 4 cams vs. 1 and 2x the valvetrain components).

My whole point is that Ford hasn't left much potential in the motor NA when compared to a LSX.... they really never do.

How much do aftermarket or worked over 4V heads cost? How much for new cams and all new valvetrain stuff? How much have they spent to get "close" to 400 rwhp out of the 4.6 NA when I can get there with LT headers and a tune in a LS6 and am 30 horse past that in a LS3.

So they didn't stroke it... fine.... but give me heads and a cam on a LS1 and I cam make 460-490 rwhp w/ easy.... 500+ on a LS3 and 550+ on a LS7.

Originally Posted by Flite

What I meant by "built for boost" was that the motor was designed with factory boosted versions in mind for future applications. This version is clearly designed to be a n/a motor. The basic design of the engine makes it very easy for Ford to build boosted versions of it in the future. The thought of which admittedly makes me feel a little funny in the pants.